tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post4564831810756221537..comments2023-05-27T02:33:34.320-07:00Comments on Nikon CLS Practical Guide: 7. How to Shoot Large Groups with Nikon CLSRuss MacDonaldhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comBlogger45125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-55460553879504022152015-11-11T22:10:05.494-08:002015-11-11T22:10:05.494-08:00Hi Russ. TJ from Nigeria here.
I am new to photog...Hi Russ. TJ from Nigeria here.<br /><br />I am new to photography and I use a Nikon D610 and SB800. I am not sure of the best settings to use for a well detailed portrait shoot. Please can you kindly recommend settings for me to use on my camera that will give me best details using my SB800. You can view my instagram page: @tjan_photography<br /><br />ThanksAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08997248282349241642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-62825340763506676852015-11-11T22:09:04.771-08:002015-11-11T22:09:04.771-08:00Hi Russ. TJ from Nigeria here.
I am new to photog...Hi Russ. TJ from Nigeria here.<br /><br />I am new to photography and I use a Nikon D610 and SB800. I am not sure of the best settings to use for a well detailed portrait shoot. Please can you kindly recommend settings for me to use on my camera that will give me best details using my SB800. You can view my instagram page: @tjan_photography<br /><br />ThanksAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08997248282349241642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-83135932381252461112013-04-02T16:57:25.631-07:002013-04-02T16:57:25.631-07:00Hi Veli,
Sorry I didn't respond to your post ...Hi Veli,<br /><br />Sorry I didn't respond to your post back in Sept. I stopped receiving emails when people posted, so I didn't know about your post until I found it manually.<br /><br />I really like Finland! I traveled to Finland many times from 1996 to 2001, and I stayed in either Helsinki or Oulu. I was working for Texas Instruments on IC's for Nokia cellular phones. I used to stay at the Hotel Presidentii in Helsinki.It had a casino called Casino Ray in it that was lots of fun.<br /><br />RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-72901655991066076402012-09-28T00:30:39.380-07:002012-09-28T00:30:39.380-07:00Greetings from Finland, dear Russ
This blog has b...Greetings from Finland, dear Russ<br /><br />This blog has become a part of my everyday life, I love it! I have learned 300% more when talking about "being a strobist", than all those videos and books that I have read earlier. With all my hearth: thank you very much.<br /><br />To give some feedback to the topic, I have to admit that I have similiar situation this weekend and I have to shoot 60 people with low end gear (D90, Nikkor 35mm f2 or 17-55 f2.8 and SB-700), and produce high end result. Your blog have gave me a lot of trust to my lowend gear, I can do pretty decent things nowdays with just these gears that I have in hands. Like said, ingenuity is the most important thing in your camerapack. <br /><br />CLS, SBs, manual settings, snoots, grids, umbrellas and softboxes are no more a uncomfortzone to me. They are tools that should be used proper ways in proper situations.<br /><br />I'm lucky get free loans of couple Elincroms studioflashes (500Ws), but I'm OK with just one SB-700. I am planning to buy SB-910 to crank my gears up a bit, and free my strobist skills to next level.<br /><br />To get this high end results with my gear, I was planning to somewhat dublicate your setup, and get flashes as close as possible, and balance ambient with flash(es) and simultaniously pop those persons up from surroundings. Results also greatly depends from weather, because if it rains heavily (not suprice in Finland @ autumn) we have to shoot this setup inside. If weathergod greets with photog-god I will get nice overcast and I can do this shot outside, in beatiful sea-view.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04610258752676198332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-58509098345451911602011-09-16T11:22:20.060-07:002011-09-16T11:22:20.060-07:00Hi Eric,
It sounds like you have the camera in A ...Hi Eric,<br /><br />It sounds like you have the camera in A mode.<br /><br />You can only change shutter speed when in S or M modes. It doesn't matter whether you have the flash on or have FP mode selected.<br /><br />RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-30305728036411125822011-09-16T08:55:16.806-07:002011-09-16T08:55:16.806-07:00Hi Russ... Love your blog.
Im in a bad spot and i...Hi Russ... Love your blog. <br />Im in a bad spot and is bothering me to no end. <br />I have a D700 and use a SB900, SB600 remotely (CLS)<br />I have auto fp320 set. I cannot change the shutter speed in camera. I can only change aperture. I dont understand. I read the manuals and still do not understand. What am I doing wrong??<br /><br />Thanks,<br />Erik D.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-90665654528694155212010-02-11T12:13:44.049-08:002010-02-11T12:13:44.049-08:00Hi Frederic,
Thanks for the compliment!
I was us...Hi Frederic,<br /><br />Thanks for the compliment!<br /><br />I was using a D200 when I wrote this, and its viewfinder is so small that manual focus, without a split image, is very difficult to do. With my D3, I find myself using manual focus a little more frequently. However, AF on the D3 works so well that there just aren't many situations where I even want to focus manually anymore.<br /><br />RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-14112137374191239292010-02-11T12:04:06.667-08:002010-02-11T12:04:06.667-08:00Hi Russ,
I first noticed this post on Nikonians so...Hi Russ,<br />I first noticed this post on Nikonians some time ago, and now have discovered your blog... good on you! Well done!<br /><br />I am curious why you chose to shoot in AF, when MF would have been quicker and easier, and saved you the steps of having to lock focus. After all the people are static, not running.<br /><br />Many thanks for the superb info you have provided.<br /><br />Cheers,<br />Frederic in MontréalFrederic Horehttp://www.remarkableimages.canoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-11157919250438213402009-12-22T19:27:21.572-08:002009-12-22T19:27:21.572-08:00Hi Rommel,
Thanks for the nice compliments!
Yes,...Hi Rommel,<br /><br />Thanks for the nice compliments!<br /><br />Yes, I see exactly the same results with my D3. And my advice is to use fixed ISO whenever shooting flash.<br /><br />I have a D70 and a D200 that behave somewhat like your D80, but they do not seem predictable, so I never use Auto ISO with flash with those cameras either.<br /><br />For indoor people shots (parties, receptions) I find it best to shoot flash with fixed ISO 400, camera Manual, f/4, and 1/80th as a starting point.<br /><br />Also, if you are shooting people at under 10 feet, it is never good to shoot flash above ISO 400. With a high ISO, the flash often can't go to a low enough power to keep from blowing things out.<br /><br />Hope that helps,<br /><br />RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-23037631139336811202009-12-22T18:18:26.546-08:002009-12-22T18:18:26.546-08:00hi, Russ!
thank you very much for this very enlig...hi, Russ!<br /><br />thank you very much for this very enlightening site. i think that your explanation of the CLS is far better than what one can find in the nikon manual and most books on the subject.<br /><br />seeing that you're probably the best authority on CLS, i would like to share with you something i encountered just recently.<br /><br />i just got a d300s. i tried shooting a few test shots using the following settings: <br />camera: Aperture priority, auto ISO on with max ISO at 1600<br />SB-800: TTL/BL<br /><br />with these settings, the camera and flash default to ISO 800. turning off auto ISO brings the ISO settings on both the camera and the flash to the ISO that i set manually (200).<br /><br />thinking that ambient light could affect the readings, i tried aiming the camera at a dark portion of the room. the ISO stayed at 800. i then aimed it at a light bulb. the ISO dropped to 200.<br /><br />this wasn't the way ttl/bl behaved on the d80. on the d80, the ISO remained at whatever manual setting i set (usually 200), and it only went up if the flash can't light up the scene properly (e.g. aperture chosen too small, subject to far,etc.)<br /><br />have you encountered this behavior? would you happen to have an idea why nikon changed the behavior of ttl/bl + auto ISO on the d300s?<br /><br />best regards,<br />Rommelrommelpbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13297302853855810125noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-44304441655067287472009-06-07T23:45:11.825-07:002009-06-07T23:45:11.825-07:00Great blog!Great blog!John Meyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17269289841578774845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-64072295596193256682009-03-27T06:10:00.000-07:002009-03-27T06:10:00.000-07:00Hi Tim,You are absolutely correct. It is always a ...Hi Tim,<BR/><BR/>You are absolutely correct. It is always a trade-off between light fall-off from front to back, light softness, and light power.<BR/><BR/>With low power speedlights, it is a balancing act. My main purpose for posting this was to show that it can be done.<BR/><BR/>You want the umbrellas as close as possible mostly due to power, so you can use a smaller aperture and increase the depth of field. If you have studio strobes that are several times stronger than the SB-800, you can back them up farther and still maintain a small aperture, and then the light fall-off decreases as well. With speedlights, you have to set them very close to keep a small enough aperture and then just live with the light fall-off.<BR/><BR/>Now, with the newer cameras (especially the D3 and D700), ISO can be increased significantly without adding objectionable noise. This will allow you to move the speedlights back farther and reduce the light fall-off problem. Of course, higher ISO will also increase the ambient contribution, so that gels on the flash might become necessary. <BR/><BR/>Regards,<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-986300453603623332009-03-27T04:09:00.000-07:002009-03-27T04:09:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Timothy Armeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427724122493243816noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-17856888451221431672009-01-29T10:37:00.000-08:002009-01-29T10:37:00.000-08:00Hi Jim,I would have used more umbrellas and flashe...Hi Jim,<BR/><BR/>I would have used more umbrellas and flashes, but there wasn't enough time to set them up. I only had about 10 minutes to set up and get this shot.<BR/><BR/>It is best to set the umbrellas so that the light is even from one end of the group to the other as well as front to back.<BR/><BR/>In this case, I positioned my two umbrellas high and pointing slightly down to minimize falloff from front to back. I also had the rows stand tight against each other to minimize the distance from front to back, both for lighting and depth of field reasons.<BR/><BR/>I set the umbrellas and camera back about eight feet from the front of the group so the light from the two umbrellas would overlap across the whole group.<BR/><BR/>You need to try to avoid having any area of the group lit by only a single umbrella, or that area will be very dark.<BR/><BR/>The main thing to avoid is aming your umbrellas at an angle to the group. That will cause shadows from members to fall on other members. You want the umbrellas facing the same direction as the camera, and close to the camera, so that any shadows will fall down and behind each member.<BR/><BR/>On a large group you should never try for a 'lighting ratio'. Keep the power of both umbrellas the same.<BR/><BR/>Hope that helps,<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-71751457982868159692009-01-29T10:04:00.000-08:002009-01-29T10:04:00.000-08:00Russ,Very helpful. You only used two SB800s in th...Russ,<BR/><BR/>Very helpful. You only used two SB800s in this shoot. Was that intentional? Could you have added two more in umbrellas. <BR/><BR/> "Anyway, I normally place my two umbrellas as high as possible and as close as possible to the group, so that the light remains soft and comes in from above the group which minimizes the fall-off between the front and back."<BR/><BR/>Would two more flanking the two you used have made it easier to use a smaller f-stop<BR/><BR/>Thanks, JimJim McDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16298837730460201601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-20926254240625794952008-12-19T05:11:00.000-08:002008-12-19T05:11:00.000-08:00Hi Daniel,No problem with translating my blogs to ...Hi Daniel,<BR/><BR/>No problem with translating my blogs to other languages. The only thing I require is a link to the original, which I notice you included.<BR/><BR/>Thanks and Merry Christmas,<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-57028522934723149952008-12-19T05:04:00.000-08:002008-12-19T05:04:00.000-08:00Hi RossGreat article, great blog!I have translated...Hi Ross<BR/>Great article, great blog!<BR/><BR/>I have translated you article "How to Shoot Large Groups with Nikon CLS" to polish language and published it on my blog.<BR/>http://domelmel.blogspot.com/2008/12/how-to-shoot-large-groups-with-nikon.html<BR/>. I hope you have no objection.<BR/><BR/>Ps.<BR/>I wish You merry Christmas!!!<BR/><BR/>best regards <BR/>Daniel from Polanddomelmelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15169872444525480590noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-70706612249979657462008-09-17T10:29:00.000-07:002008-09-17T10:29:00.000-07:00Hi Ross,For me, the noise above ISO 400 on the D20...Hi Ross,<BR/><BR/>For me, the noise above ISO 400 on the D200 is just too high for groups. If you go up to ISO 800 you can use noise reduction software like Noise Ninja to smooth out the image and that looks real nice untill you start looking closely at the individuals in the group.<BR/><BR/>With group shots prints are often examined much closer than with other kinds of prints, and then is when you see that detail has been lost with Noise Ninja and faces don't look so good.<BR/><BR/>So, you are correct; I don't recommend anything higher than ISO 400 for groups, and use less than ISO 400 if you have enough flash power.<BR/><BR/>Regards,<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-88815747758473822582008-09-17T09:59:00.000-07:002008-09-17T09:59:00.000-07:00Hi Russ, Thanks for the update and also for answer...Hi Russ, Thanks for the update and also for answering a question I hadn't asked yet. My next question was going to be what ISO setting you would normally use for large group. Although I have successfully used ISO's as high as 800 and even 1600 on my D200 for individuals or couples I was not sure I should go that high with a group shot given the relatively small portion of the frame each individual would take up. I am shooting a group of about 40 people this weekend with 2 SB800 and 2 40 inch umbrella's so I am really keen to put all this good advice to use. So you would not recommend going higher that ISO 400 on a D200 for a group this large?<BR/><BR/>RossAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-11165293016605252532008-09-17T06:25:00.000-07:002008-09-17T06:25:00.000-07:00Hi Chris,Umbrellas come in sizes from 30 inches to...Hi Chris,<BR/><BR/>Umbrellas come in sizes from 30 inches to 60 inches.<BR/><BR/>I'd say 40 inches is the most common. At 40 inches, I use the diffuser lens on the SB-800.<BR/><BR/>At less than 40 inches, I'd probably not use the diffuser lens.<BR/><BR/>However, it all depends on the length of the shaft.<BR/><BR/>In any case, is easy to tell whether you need the diffuser lens or not. Just use the test button to fire the flash as you watch the pattern it makes on the umbrella. It should go all the way to the edge without spilling over the edges. You can widen or shrink this pattern by adding or removing the diffuser lens or by moving the umbrella farther or nearer the flash by sliding it back and forth on its shaft in the universal holder.<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-51902994590408006412008-09-17T05:14:00.000-07:002008-09-17T05:14:00.000-07:00Hi Russ, can you qualify 'large' vs 'small' umbrel...Hi Russ, can you qualify 'large' vs 'small' umbrella? I.e. is a 32" umbrella a small?<BR/><BR/>Thanks...<BR/><BR/>ChrisChris Wraighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01075724447875575293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-48083423874047088452008-09-17T04:14:00.000-07:002008-09-17T04:14:00.000-07:00Bill,The diffuser lens doesn't cause much power lo...Bill,<BR/><BR/>The diffuser lens doesn't cause much power loss since it is transparent instead of translucent. A diffuser lens redirects the light in multiple directions based on the facets in its design without as much loss.<BR/><BR/>A diffuser like the snap-on that comes with the SB-800 is translucent, and it does cause a large power loss. <BR/><BR/>So, it really depends on how big your umbrellas are and how long the shaft is on the holder. You simply want to make sure the light from the flash is widened so that it completely fills the umbrella without spilling past it.<BR/><BR/>So, with a small umbrella and a long shaft, you probably would not want the diffuser lens in place.<BR/><BR/>And with a large umbrella, you probably do want the lens in place.<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-23166041012158530322008-09-16T16:03:00.000-07:002008-09-16T16:03:00.000-07:00So if I was shooting through an umbrella or bounci...So if I was shooting through an umbrella or bouncing off it, I should pull down the built-in diffuser? That mean you are diffusing twice and losing flash power twice. <BR/><BR/>Is one time enough? I wouldn't want to add a stoffen diffuser into the mix.<BR/><BR/>Thanksbillmorishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06332711569257738847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-28174708629561796582008-09-16T14:19:00.000-07:002008-09-16T14:19:00.000-07:00Hi Chris,Yes, you're right.Thanks,RussHi Chris,<BR/><BR/>Yes, you're right.<BR/><BR/>Thanks,<BR/><BR/>RussRuss MacDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15288785902650834143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113726419970930271.post-47803663650623105142008-09-16T12:17:00.000-07:002008-09-16T12:17:00.000-07:00hi Russ,If you pull out the built-in diffuser, I t...hi Russ,<BR/><BR/>If you pull out the built-in diffuser, I think this automatically sets the flash to 14mm, regardless of its 'current' setting....<BR/><BR/>ChrisChris Wraighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01075724447875575293noreply@blogger.com